Chapter Discussion Return to Reverie Chapter 6: The Beginning of the End

[Nessos]

The final chapter of Artur's One Piece fanfic "Return to Reverie" is up

Return to the Reverie – Chapter 6 (FINALE)

Here it is! The grand finale of the Return to the Reverie Project! Enjoy the culmination of all our work, a 30 page spectacular filled to the brim with theories, surprises, and emotion! &#82…

thelibraryofohara.com

 

[Salah Eddine]

I totally agree with Im being Rocks D. Xebec, there are many Hints to support it
But i honestly didn't like the Nefertari Incident for one reason, i don't understand how Artur missed that

Vivi in early Plans was gonna make her exit after Whiskey Peak and she wasn't a Princess at first, but Alabasta Arc was still gonna happen.
Saying Oda not only changed his mind & made her a Princess but also Pluton doesn't make sense at all

 

[Nessos]

I totally agree with Im being Rocks D. Xebec, there are many Hints to support it
But i honestly didn't like the Nefertari Incident for one reason, i don't understand how Artur missed that

Vivi in early Plans was gonna make her exit after Whiskey Peak and she wasn't a Princess at first, but Alabasta Arc was still gonna happen.
Saying Oda not only changed his mind & made her a Princess but also Pluton doesn't make sense at all

Don't think that Xebec is Im. For me Xebec is Just a new introduced character showing us what happened in the time before the era of Roger, Whiteboard and Shiki. With Oda using the Chance to explain how Garp and Roger are connected and also how Garp became such a famous hero.

I started to believe God Valley accident is actually linked to Uranus. That Xebec tried to find Uranus un God's Valley. That would be quite similiar to Crocodiles desire trying to obtain Pluton.



I totally agree with you about Vivi being Pluton it feels a bit forced. I am still up for Pluton being a ship.

 

[Salah Eddine]

Don't think that Xebec is Im. For me Xebec is Just a new introduced character showing us what happened in the time before the era of Roger, Whiteboard and Shiki. With Oda using the Chance to explain how Garp and Roger are connected and also how Garp became such a famous hero.

I started to believe God Valley accident is actually linked to Uranus. That Xebec tried to find Uranus un God's Valley. That would be quite similar to Crocodiles desire trying to obtain Pluton.



I totally agree with you about Vivi being Pluton it feels a bit forced. I am still up for Pluton being a ship.

I will tell you my reasons why i think Im-Sama is truly Rocks D. Xebec

Spoiler: Portrayal

First of all they were both Mentioned at same time, secondly they represent the greatest Danger known in both Pirate Side & WG Side
So Im being Rocks would be the perfect Final Villain who ties into both Pirate & Government Worlds

Both were portrayed as Short which can't be a coincidence, Oda loves making Enemies Bigger to portray Danger sometimes and yet he chose that Rocks the Captain of all those Monsters is Short Character, same as Im-Sama
Another detail that can't be coincidence is that Rocks Dream was basically sitting where Im is now & he is tied to Celestial Dragons

You said Rocks is just a Character introduced to show us Era before Roger, but that contradicts Oda's claims before
When WB met Shanks, Oda revealed he decided not to mention Shiki there to not confuse Fans
But lately, Oda not only teased Rocks few times but he dedicated a Full Chapter to Hype him (Chapter 957)

And he already said that BM & Kaido & WB were already Famous Pirates before Roger's Era
If he wanted to Hype BM & Kaido's Alliance he could have just said that those Pirates made an Alliance (Members of Rocks)
But no, Oda made sure that all those Big Names have and even added new ones had a Captain who can hold them together
Even when Oda hyped Roger & Garp by revealing that they are the ones who defeated Rocks, he didn't need that, just saying that Roger & Garp stopped all those Monsters combined would suffice to Hype them, maybe even more

Spoiler: Story Pattern

But regarding Story, here is what i believe
All Villains in One Piece share many similarities but the one that really interested me is the fact that they are all Traitors
Orochi, Doflamingo, Blackbeard, Lucci, Sterry, Enel, Hody, Kuro, Wapol .... etc

But that's not all, the really interesting part is that they betray People who they once belonged with
Orochi's Family were among Nobles, they got Persecuted, and then Orochi joined Kozuki Family as an Outsider and betrayed them
Doflamingo's Family were once CDs, they lost that, and then Doffy returned to Dressrosa as an Outsider, betrayed them
Blackbeard was once considered a Son of WB, he betrayed him, and then returned as a New Captain/Outsider, killed him
Sterry became a Noble but he is an Outsider since he was Adopted and then he betrayed Royal Family
Enel was a Birkan, but he destroyed his Home & abandoned his Wings & went to Skypiea as an Outsider and then betrayed them
Wapol was once King of Drum Island, but he abandoned it when BB Pirates came and then returned as a Pirate & tried to take it back
Even Lucci was removed from CP-9 and he was a Traitor & Outsider to Galley-La Company, but now returned as CP-0
And this continues with so many other Villains ... etc

If you can notice here, these Villains truly belonged to the Group they betrayed once, and then after gaining Power, returned & replaced them
In other words, they think they are retaking the Position that they believe was rightfully theirs and in the process, they gain Powers, treated as Outsiders & become Traitors. And just like each Villain met someone who they caused to die and had an Inspiring Death (Oden, Rosinante, WB, Noland, Tom, Saul, Bell-Mere, Hiluluk & much more), they also had a Rebel Character trying to face them by failing (Genzo, Kohza, Wiper, Kyros, Paulie, Kin'emon, Marco, Dalton .... etc) and finally a Character who was inspired & is the one that connected Luffy to that Villain (Momo, Law, Ace, Cricket, Franky, Robin, Nami, Chopper .... etc)

As you can see, there is clearly a Pattern here repeated by Oda who said that the Final Arc is the only Arc he always planned & never changed & every other Arcs are build up to it that he comes up with along the way
So in Final Arc, who is Final Villain? it's Im-Sama! Who is the inspiring Death? Obviously Roger! Who is inspired Character that connected Luffy to this Story? Shanks ofc and who is the Rebel Character? No other than Dragon himself (And all these Characters were introduced in first Saga, Oda already introduced the ones that matter at the end from the Start just like he said he only had Final Arc in mind when he started OP)

The Pattern is the same, Roger was executed by WG, indirectly by Im-Sama basically and him being Rocks makes sense since this means Roger was indirectly killed by his Greatest Rival as Sengoku said, just like all other Inspiring Deaths were killed by Biggest Villain they met

Spoiler: Im-Sama & Rocks

Now let's apply what we learned about Villains on Im-Sama
He should be Outsider to Celestial Dragons but who have an Origin that makes him one of them once, he is Traitor to his Kind who returned & restored his Power (Just like what happened with Orochi, Doflamingo, Blackbeard, Wapol, Enel & many others)

So we are looking for someone who recently was against Celestial Dragons but aimed to Rule Them with a Name that connects him to them in the Distant Past? There is no one who matches this Description except Rocks D. Xebec, he was a Pirate aiming to sit on the Empty Throne & attacked Celestial Dragons to do that carrying the Name that once had History with their Ancestors and represents their Enemy just like Kurozumi! (D. Family)

Rocks is the Man who refused his D. Name and aimed to retake the Power that should have been his Birthright, just like Villains for their Revenge obtained Powers that made others Bow to them like Doffy a CD showcasing CoC, Enel obtaining DF that no other Sky Islander have, Orochi obtaining the help of Kaido .... etc Im too have a Unique Power that makes even Gorosei bow to him and accept him as their Ruler which is National Treasure combined with his incredible strength as a Famous Pirate

This should tell us approximately what happened in Void Century, if Rocks is a D. making him Enemy of Celestial Dragons but he believes Empty Throne should be rightfully his, that means his Ancestor was among 20 Ruling Kingdoms or maybe they were 21 actually!!!
It's the Ancient Kingdom, and just like Artur said, that Kingdom was Home to all Races & Joy Boy was their King, the Man who United them just like Luffy is uniting everyone he meets (Power that Mihawk described as Greatest of All)

D. Family who are Survivors of Ancient Kingdom, branded as Enemies of the World & WG/CDs
Rocks returning to take what he thinks should rightfully be his (Just like Orochi's Family who were candidates to Rule)
But the true Ruler should be the one who inherited Joy Boy's Will, the one who have that Power i just described

This is why i believe Im-Sama being Rocks makes perfect sense for the Story & ties into everything
There are many other things i want to mention, especially regarding Void Century
I agree with Artur on two things which is Im being Rocks & Ancient Kingdom being All Races Nation ruled by Joy Boy
I disagree with most of the rest, i believe he collected the right hints but made the wrong conclusions, just my opinion anyway

 

[Lemonade]

Eh this is way too speculative.

 

[Nessos]

I will tell you my reasons why i think Im-Sama is truly Rocks D. Xebec

Spoiler: Portrayal

First of all they were both Mentioned at same time, secondly they represent the greatest Danger known in both Pirate Side & WG Side
So Im being Rocks would be the perfect Final Villain who ties into both Pirate & Government Worlds

Both were portrayed as Short which can't be a coincidence, Oda loves making Enemies Bigger to portray Danger sometimes and yet he chose that Rocks the Captain of all those Monsters is Short Character, same as Im-Sama
Another detail that can't be coincidence is that Rocks Dream was basically sitting where Im is now & he is tied to Celestial Dragons

You said Rocks is just a Character introduced to show us Era before Roger, but that contradicts Oda's claims before
When WB met Shanks, Oda revealed he decided not to mention Shiki there to not confuse Fans
But lately, Oda not only teased Rocks few times but he dedicated a Full Chapter to Hype him (Chapter 957)

And he already said that BM & Kaido & WB were already Famous Pirates before Roger's Era
If he wanted to Hype BM & Kaido's Alliance he could have just said that those Pirates made an Alliance (Members of Rocks)
But no, Oda made sure that all those Big Names have and even added new ones had a Captain who can hold them together
Even when Oda hyped Roger & Garp by revealing that they are the ones who defeated Rocks, he didn't need that, just saying that Roger & Garp stopped all those Monsters combined would suffice to Hype them, maybe even more

Spoiler: Story Pattern

But regarding Story, here is what i believe
All Villains in One Piece share many similarities but the one that really interested me is the fact that they are all Traitors
Orochi, Doflamingo, Blackbeard, Lucci, Sterry, Enel, Hody, Kuro, Wapol .... etc

But that's not all, the really interesting part is that they betray People who they once belonged with
Orochi's Family were among Nobles, they got Persecuted, and then Orochi joined Kozuki Family as an Outsider and betrayed them
Doflamingo's Family were once CDs, they lost that, and then Doffy returned to Dressrosa as an Outsider, betrayed them
Blackbeard was once considered a Son of WB, he betrayed him, and then returned as a New Captain/Outsider, killed him
Sterry became a Noble but he is an Outsider since he was Adopted and then he betrayed Royal Family
Enel was a Birkan, but he destroyed his Home & abandoned his Wings & went to Skypiea as an Outsider and then betrayed them
Wapol was once King of Drum Island, but he abandoned it when BB Pirates came and then returned as a Pirate & tried to take it back
Even Lucci was removed from CP-9 and he was a Traitor & Outsider to Galley-La Company, but now returned as CP-0
And this continues with so many other Villains ... etc

If you can notice here, these Villains truly belonged to the Group they betrayed once, and then after gaining Power, returned & replaced them
In other words, they think they are retaking the Position that they believe was rightfully theirs and in the process, they gain Powers, treated as Outsiders & become Traitors. And just like each Villain met someone who they caused to die and had an Inspiring Death (Oden, Rosinante, WB, Noland, Tom, Saul, Bell-Mere, Hiluluk & much more), they also had a Rebel Character trying to face them by failing (Genzo, Kohza, Wiper, Kyros, Paulie, Kin'emon, Marco, Dalton .... etc) and finally a Character who was inspired & is the one that connected Luffy to that Villain (Momo, Law, Ace, Cricket, Franky, Robin, Nami, Chopper .... etc)

As you can see, there is clearly a Pattern here repeated by Oda who said that the Final Arc is the only Arc he always planned & never changed & every other Arcs are build up to it that he comes up with along the way
So in Final Arc, who is Final Villain? it's Im-Sama! Who is the inspiring Death? Obviously Roger! Who is inspired Character that connected Luffy to this Story? Shanks ofc and who is the Rebel Character? No other than Dragon himself (And all these Characters were introduced in first Saga, Oda already introduced the ones that matter at the end from the Start just like he said he only had Final Arc in mind when he started OP)

The Pattern is the same, Roger was executed by WG, indirectly by Im-Sama basically and him being Rocks makes sense since this means Roger was indirectly killed by his Greatest Rival as Sengoku said, just like all other Inspiring Deaths were killed by Biggest Villain they met

Spoiler: Im-Sama & Rocks

Now let's apply what we learned about Villains on Im-Sama
He should be Outsider to Celestial Dragons but who have an Origin that makes him one of them once, he is Traitor to his Kind who returned & restored his Power (Just like what happened with Orochi, Doflamingo, Blackbeard, Wapol, Enel & many others)

So we are looking for someone who recently was against Celestial Dragons but aimed to Rule Them with a Name that connects him to them in the Distant Past? There is no one who matches this Description except Rocks D. Xebec, he was a Pirate aiming to sit on the Empty Throne & attacked Celestial Dragons to do that carrying the Name that once had History with their Ancestors and represents their Enemy just like Kurozumi! (D. Family)

Rocks is the Man who refused his D. Name and aimed to retake the Power that should have been his Birthright, just like Villains for their Revenge obtained Powers that made others Bow to them like Doffy a CD showcasing CoC, Enel obtaining DF that no other Sky Islander have, Orochi obtaining the help of Kaido .... etc Im too have a Unique Power that makes even Gorosei bow to him and accept him as their Ruler which is National Treasure combined with his incredible strength as a Famous Pirate

This should tell us approximately what happened in Void Century, if Rocks is a D. making him Enemy of Celestial Dragons but he believes Empty Throne should be rightfully his, that means his Ancestor was among 20 Ruling Kingdoms or maybe they were 21 actually!!!
It's the Ancient Kingdom, and just like Artur said, that Kingdom was Home to all Races & Joy Boy was their King, the Man who United them just like Luffy is uniting everyone he meets (Power that Mihawk described as Greatest of All)

D. Family who are Survivors of Ancient Kingdom, branded as Enemies of the World & WG/CDs
Rocks returning to take what he thinks should rightfully be his (Just like Orochi's Family who were candidates to Rule)
But the true Ruler should be the one who inherited Joy Boy's Will, the one who have that Power i just described

This is why i believe Im-Sama being Rocks makes perfect sense for the Story & ties into everything
There are many other things i want to mention, especially regarding Void Century
I agree with Artur on two things which is Im being Rocks & Ancient Kingdom being All Races Nation ruled by Joy Boy
I disagree with most of the rest, i believe he collected the right hints but made the wrong conclusions, just my opinion anyway

Sure these points makes a lot of sense, but there is one reason I am doubting Xebec being Im and thats the Outcome of the God Valley accident.

Sure Sengoku Said nothing about what happened to Xebec afterwards so he definetly survived the Gods Valley accident. But Xebec loosing followed by him senaking into Mary Geosis start to control the 5 Elders just sounds wrong for me. Thats why I prefer the idea of Xebec raising Teach after the war (it fits perfectly with name of Teach ship "Saber of Xebec"). So storywise it would also makes sense that Xebec is for Teach what Roger is for Luffy. So yeah I am not really a fan of the idea that an old geezer who already got defeated in the past becomes the final super villain

For me there are currently 3 potential endboss characters.

• Teach -> Pirate Endboss
• Sakazuki -> Marine Endboss
• Im -> Celestial Dragon Endboss

 

[Salah Eddine]

Sure these points makes a lot of sense, but there is one reason I am doubting Xebec being Im and thats the Outcome of the God Valley accident.

Sure Sengoku Said nothing about what happened to Xebec afterwards so he definetly survived the Gods Valley accident. But Xebec loosing followed by him senaking into Mary Geosis start to control the 5 Elders just sounds wrong for me. Thats why I prefer the idea of Xebec raising Teach after the war (it fits perfectly with name of Teach ship "Saber of Xebec"). So storywise it would also makes sense that Xebec is for Teach what Roger is for Luffy. So yeah I am not really a fan of the idea that an old geezer who already got defeated in the past becomes the final super villain

For me there are currently 3 potential endboss characters.

• Teach -> Pirate Endboss
• Sakazuki -> Marine Endboss
• Im -> Celestial Dragon Endboss

If you think of it that way then it will definitely look weird, but i didn't say Rocks sneaked into Mary Geose or anything
We still don't know exactly what happened in Gods Valley, it's possible the whole Island was destroyed on purpose to cover up Rocks survival
And that he was already going to sit on the Empty Throne

Another Villain similarity i didn't mention before is about their most loyal Servants, they are mostly not just Henchmen but Characters who share History with the Villain and want to fulfill his Revenge, Orochi's Kurozumi Elders & Kanjuro, Doflamingo's Executives, Enel's Birkan Priests, Arlong's friends from Childhood & Sun Pirate ... etc
Even Blackbeard, Oda made sure that all his Crew are Corrupt People who had a Job before (Corrupt Sheriff, Corrupt Doctor, Corrupt King, Corrupt Warden, Corrupt Bounty Hunter .... etc)

So the same thing applies for Im-Sama, he most probably had Allies from the very beginning, his most trusted Servants, none other than Gorosei! that's why i believe they were his Allies even before he sat on the Empty Throne
It's not like he acquired their Loyalty after, but they always wanted to make him King just like most other Villains

And i don't believe he is an Old Man, i also believe he had Ope Ope No Mi's Ability used on him, because let's be honest, there is no way Oda added such an Ability in the Story if it wasn't already used on someone and who makes sense?
Earlier theories claimed Gorosei were Immortal but after seeing them bow to Im-Sama, it's pretty clear he is the one who must have had the Operation done on him. This also explains why Doflamingo said that the Operation used on him combined with his Knowledge will make him rule everything, because he learned about Im-Sama

Finally, i don't disagree with Blackbeard being an End Boss at all, it's just that you're assuming Final Boss needs to only be one Character which isn't the case at all, Blackbeard will still be a Major Character in Final Arc and will be so influential same as Luffy

But if you re-check the Pattern i told you about, the Final Villain is someone who directly or indirectly killed Roger (Inspiring Death), a Revo Character is fighting against him and Shanks (Inspired Character who met Luffy) is related to him in some way
Just like Doflamingo --> Rocinante --> Law --> Kyros or Orochi --> Oden --> Momo --> Kin'emon or Hody --> Otohime --> Shirahoshi --> Fukaboshi .... etc

Blackbeard not only have his Pattern already with WB Pirates since he Killed WB (Inspiring Death) the Man who inspired Ace (Inspired Character who met Luffy) and Revo Character Marco who lost against him (Payback War) and all this resulted in BB replacing WB
And if we apply him to Overall Story, Dragon have nothing to do with BB, he aims to defeat WG/Im-Sama, this already show that Im is the Final Villain, not BB. Also Roger got executed by WG & fought Rocks in the past, Blackbeard have nothing to do with him or his Death.
You can say Shanks have history with BB, but Oda made sure he have history with Gorosei too, this is another Hint at how Im is the Villain that connects all Major Players. BB being inspired by Xebec is just Oda's way to make him related and add him as a Major Player in Final Arc too

Actually this could be the whole motivation behind Dragon creating Revo Army, most Revo Characters in previous Arcs fight because of the Knowledge they have that other Citizens don't, they know the Villain's Plans
So it makes sense that Roger learned about Im/Rocks & told Dragon not only about him but also CDs Origin which made him start Revos Army

As for Akainu, he is no Villain, please stop calling him one, seriously what did he do? is killing Ace something Villainous to do? The guy is a Marine, that's his Job, just because he have an Absolute Justice Philosophy doesn't make him a Villain, i mean look at Garp when Hina told him about Akainu's reply regarding Wano, he laughed and said that he expected such reply from Akainu, does this look like a Grandfather angry at Akainu for killing his Grandson? Ofc not, he is totally cool and no one ever said Akainu is Corrupt or unworthy of Leadership
Even if you say he killed Oharan escapees, he wasn't portrayed as Villain of that Arc or anything, it still doesn't change the fact that CP-9 & Marines too destroyed Ohara & all it's People, even Aokiji caught his friend Saul which led to his death (Assuming he didn't kill him himself)

I mean sure they will fight him and maybe he will resign or get removed and replaced by someone else like Fujitora maybe who is fit or Aokiji or whatever (Maybe that's why Aokiji was made younger than other Admirals) but it doesn't change the fact that Akainu is no Villain
Akainu's Role in Final Arc will be same as Fujitora's Role in Dressrosa Arc & Smoker in Alabasta Arc
Saying Akainu is a Villain is same as saying Fujitora was Main Villain of Dressrosa which isn't the case
Fujitora was helping Doflamingo just like Akainu will help WG while both hating them and eventually stop helping them just like Fujitora & Smoker stopped interfering Mid-War

Just like Alabasta Arc Quote
Those who lament the War (Civilians & Innocents & Kings/Queens)
Those who fight trying to remove corruption (Dragon & Sabo & all Revos Army)
Those who try to keep the Peace & Order & are caught in the middle of this War (Akainu & Fujitora & all Marines)
Those who are hiding in the Shadows causing this War & deceiving everyone (Im-Sama & Gorosei & all CDs)
Those who know the Truth, try to put it on themselves to stop this War & the Villain (Luffy & SHs & Allies who uncover the Truth)

 

[Nessos]

If you think of it that way then it will definitely look weird, but i didn't say Rocks sneaked into Mary Geose or anything
We still don't know exactly what happened in Gods Valley, it's possible the whole Island was destroyed on purpose to cover up Rocks survival
And that he was already going to sit on the Empty Throne

Another Villain similarity i didn't mention before is about their most loyal Servants, they are mostly not just Henchmen but Characters who share History with the Villain and want to fulfill his Revenge, Orochi's Kurozumi Elders & Kanjuro, Doflamingo's Executives, Enel's Birkan Priests, Arlong's friends from Childhood & Sun Pirate ... etc
Even Blackbeard, Oda made sure that all his Crew are Corrupt People who had a Job before (Corrupt Sheriff, Corrupt Doctor, Corrupt King, Corrupt Warden, Corrupt Bounty Hunter .... etc)

So the same thing applies for Im-Sama, he most probably had Allies from the very beginning, his most trusted Servants, none other than Gorosei! that's why i believe they were his Allies even before he sat on the Empty Throne
It's not like he acquired their Loyalty after, but they always wanted to make him King just like most other Villains

And i don't believe he is an Old Man, i also believe he had Ope Ope No Mi's Ability used on him, because let's be honest, there is no way Oda added such an Ability in the Story if it wasn't already used on someone and who makes sense?
Earlier theories claimed Gorosei were Immortal but after seeing them bow to Im-Sama, it's pretty clear he is the one who must have had the Operation done on him. This also explains why Doflamingo said that the Operation used on him combined with his Knowledge will make him rule everything, because he learned about Im-Sama

Finally, i don't disagree with Blackbeard being an End Boss at all, it's just that you're assuming Final Boss needs to only be one Character which isn't the case at all, Blackbeard will still be a Major Character in Final Arc and will be so influential same as Luffy

But if you re-check the Pattern i told you about, the Final Villain is someone who directly or indirectly killed Roger (Inspiring Death), a Revo Character is fighting against him and Shanks (Inspired Character who met Luffy) is related to him in some way
Just like Doflamingo --> Rocinante --> Law --> Kyros or Orochi --> Oden --> Momo --> Kin'emon or Hody --> Otohime --> Shirahoshi --> Fukaboshi .... etc

Blackbeard not only have his Pattern already with WB Pirates since he Killed WB (Inspiring Death) the Man who inspired Ace (Inspired Character who met Luffy) and Revo Character Marco who lost against him (Payback War) and all this resulted in BB replacing WB
And if we apply him to Overall Story, Dragon have nothing to do with BB, he aims to defeat WG/Im-Sama, this already show that Im is the Final Villain, not BB. Also Roger got executed by WG & fought Rocks in the past, Blackbeard have nothing to do with him or his Death.
You can say Shanks have history with BB, but Oda made sure he have history with Gorosei too, this is another Hint at how Im is the Villain that connects all Major Players. BB being inspired by Xebec is just Oda's way to make him related and add him as a Major Player in Final Arc too

Actually this could be the whole motivation behind Dragon creating Revo Army, most Revo Characters in previous Arcs fight because of the Knowledge they have that other Citizens don't, they know the Villain's Plans
So it makes sense that Roger learned about Im/Rocks & told Dragon not only about him but also CDs Origin which made him start Revos Army

As for Akainu, he is no Villain, please stop calling him one, seriously what did he do? is killing Ace something Villainous to do? The guy is a Marine, that's his Job, just because he have an Absolute Justice Philosophy doesn't make him a Villain, i mean look at Garp when Hina told him about Akainu's reply regarding Wano, he laughed and said that he expected such reply from Akainu, does this look like a Grandfather angry at Akainu for killing his Grandson? Ofc not, he is totally cool and no one ever said Akainu is Corrupt or unworthy of Leadership
Even if you say he killed Oharan escapees, he wasn't portrayed as Villain of that Arc or anything, it still doesn't change the fact that CP-9 & Marines too destroyed Ohara & all it's People, even Aokiji caught his friend Saul which led to his death (Assuming he didn't kill him himself)

I mean sure they will fight him and maybe he will resign or get removed and replaced by someone else like Fujitora maybe who is fit or Aokiji or whatever (Maybe that's why Aokiji was made younger than other Admirals) but it doesn't change the fact that Akainu is no Villain
Akainu's Role in Final Arc will be same as Fujitora's Role in Dressrosa Arc & Smoker in Alabasta Arc
Saying Akainu is a Villain is same as saying Fujitora was Main Villain of Dressrosa which isn't the case
Fujitora was helping Doflamingo just like Akainu will help WG while both hating them and eventually stop helping them just like Fujitora & Smoker stopped interfering Mid-War

Just like Alabasta Arc Quote
Those who lament the War (Civilians & Innocents & Kings/Queens)
Those who fight trying to remove corruption (Dragon & Sabo & all Revos Army)
Those who try to keep the Peace & Order & are caught in the middle of this War (Akainu & Fujitora & all Marines)
Those who are hiding in the Shadows causing this War & deceiving everyone (Im-Sama & Gorosei & all CDs)
Those who know the Truth, try to put it on themselves to stop this War & the Villain (Luffy & SHs & Allies who uncover the Truth)

I can completly understand what you mean. Sure ageless surgery might be a thing (and I have to admit I like the Idea of Im being from the time of VC becoming Immortal through ageless surgery).

But still don't like the idea of Xebec = Im. Destroying Island cover up his death? Why should Celestial Cover up the death of someone whontried to attack then? Again Marines and Pirates unite to stop him and protect Celestial Dragons. Doubt Garp wouldn't Open His mouth If defeat wasn't legit.

Teach can become final villain by using One Piece or Ancient Weapon or whatever is Hidden on Laugh Tale to conquer the world. Also Teach is already connected to alll the secrets by being a D. and also have the super villain Potential by having 2 overpowered DFs.

Sakazuki is a villain. Sure one can say He all dies this for a good reason, but never forget he is radical. If one stands in his way he have to die. Don't care about Ace, but he was ready to kill Coby and killed refugees of Ohara. Like Luffy being a hero while being a criminal, Sakazuki is a villain fighting for justice.
And yes Sakazuki can become final villain with him becoming the One Piece version of Hitler. Possibility of him taking over the WG is there.


So yeah both Sakazuki and Teach have the Potential to become final villain besides Im. Like they were always Potential final villains besides the Gorosei before Im was introduced.

 

[Salah Eddine]

I can completly understand what you mean. Sure ageless surgery might be a thing (and I have to admit I like the Idea of Im being from the time of VC becoming Immortal through ageless surgery).

But still don't like the idea of Xebec = Im. Destroying Island cover up his death? Why should Celestial Cover up the death of someone whontried to attack then? Again Marines and Pirates unite to stop him and protect Celestial Dragons. Doubt Garp wouldn't Open His mouth If defeat wasn't legit.

Teach can become final villain by using One Piece or Ancient Weapon or whatever is Hidden on Laugh Tale to conquer the world. Also Teach is already connected to alll the secrets by being a D. and also have the super villain Potential by having 2 overpowered DFs.

Sakazuki is a villain. Sure one can say He all dies this for a good reason, but never forget he is radical. If one stands in his way he have to die. Don't care about Ace, but he was ready to kill Coby and killed refugees of Ohara. Like Luffy being a hero while being a criminal, Sakazuki is a villain fighting for justice.
And yes Sakazuki can become final villain with him becoming the One Piece version of Hitler. Possibility of him taking over the WG is there.


So yeah both Sakazuki and Teach have the Potential to become final villain besides Im. Like they were always Potential final villains besides the Gorosei before Im was introduced.

I didn't say CDs destroyed island to cover his death, i just suggested the idea, however they do destroy islands to cover entire events just like Enies Lobby, Rocks escaping was just something that happened while island is being destroyed (Just like Lucci escaped & survived), if it wasn't for Blueno & others, Lucci would have been dead too

I already told u why Rocks feels more like Final Villain than Teach, it's because he already have everything Teach have & more, D. Name, Title, connection to CDs, Void Century, Pirates, Roger, Shanks, Dragon, Luffy, Vivi, Shirahoshi, Marines .... etc this guy is at the center of everything that Oda made important in both East Blue Saga & entire One Piece

Teach is the second best and i arleady told u i don't disagree with Teach being Final Villain material, i just said he will share it with Im just like Orochi/Kaido, Spandam/Lucci, Hody/Vander, BM/Katakuri, Moriah/Kuma, Kaido/BM, Ceasar/Vergo .... etc
It's not something new for Oda to introduce two threats in One Arc

Luffy isn't Hero, he said it himself, Pirates are Criminals, Shanks too is the same Type of Pirate as Luffy and he said it himself that they aren't Saints or Bandits, they are Pirates, the scum of the earth. Marines are never evil, they are the good guys, it's just that each one have his own Justice, Fujitora is also taking a wrong approach by having blind justice, Aokiji was lazy, Kizaru is just neutral, Sengoku too was extreme ... etc
Actually Akainu is same as Smoker & Fujitora, he hates Pirates a lot, he also hates WG & CDs, that's not Villain Material, he is Antagonist Material which is different

Villains in One Piece are Oppressors & Traitors & Tricksters, Akainu is none of them, he is just extremely strict
Sengoku, Garp & literally every single Marine talk about him with Respect & consider him a great Leader

 

[Emperor Cross]

Aikanu = OP’s Hitler ? Let’s not go that far

 

[Nessos]

Actually Akainu is same as Smoker & Fujitora, he hates Pirates a lot, he also hates WG & CDs, that's not Villain Material, he is Antagonist Material which is different

Imagine Sakazuki would have been in the same Situation as Issho at the end of Dressrosa, what do you think would have happened?
For me the answer is quite simple, he wouldn't have hold back and would have killed any citizen of DR standing in his way. Thats why he have the potential to turn into an endboss villain.
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Aikanu = OP’s Hitler ? Let’s not go that far

He definetly has the potential to turn into it.

 

[Emperor Cross]

Akainu is against all supposed threats to the WG and the « world peace ».

On ohara he was ruthless, he killed innocent because he didn’t want the possibility of one the scholars surviving and teaching after how to read poneglyphs.

At Marineford he killed the soldiers that were running away from their job and was going to kill Coby because he made him lose his time, which again was extreme. Them seconds saved Luffy and most of the WB.

He would probably kill anyone trying to help a pirate but HITLER ?! That is TOOO FAAR, pirates ain’t the good guys. Most them are scums. (The WG is flawed too. Cds are the worst)

 

[Salah Eddine]

Imagine Sakazuki would have been in the same Situation as Issho at the end of Dressrosa, what do you think would have happened?
For me the answer is quite simple, he wouldn't have hold back and would have killed any citizen of DR standing in his way. Thats why he have the potential to turn into an endboss villain.

What??? Kill Dressrosa Citizens? You think he is a Psycho or what!!
He hates those who don't do their Jobs and would kill Pirates & anyone branded Criminals without second thought
He would never kill Innocent Civilians just because a Shichibukai lost in their Country

 

[Nessos]

What??? Kill Dressrosa Citizens? You think he is a Psycho or what!!
He hates those who don't do their Jobs and would kill Pirates & anyone branded Criminals without second thought
He would never kill Innocent Civilians just because a Shichibukai lost in their Country

Yeah I am talking about the psychon who killed every innocent civillian of Ohara cause there was a chance of a scholar among them. The same psycho who was ready to kill Coby cause he wanted to stop the war.

And yes I expect the same psycho would kill any innocent civillian who tries to protect a pirate.

 

[Salah Eddine]

Yeah I am talking about the psychon who killed every innocent civillian of Ohara cause there was a chance of a scholar among them. The same psycho who was ready to kill Coby cause he wanted to stop the war.

And yes I expect the same psycho would kill any innocent civillian who tries to protect a pirate.

They literally gave them orders to destroy all Ohara and all it's inhabitants !!
Was Robin a Scholar? Why did she have a 79 Million Bounty on her head, because Akainu wanted her dead?
Coby didn't just stand in his way, he was a Marine under his Authority and he was acting against Orders

You're saying Akainu would kill Dressrosa Citizens to hide the defeat of Doflamingo, that's crazy!!

That's Absolute Justice, they told them Ohara are Criminals, Destroy it, Akainu did it with Cold Blood
Oda simply hypes his cold personality so that he is considered a threat in Final Arc, he isn't a Leader they should take lightly
But he isn't a Psycho, i told you go check Garp casually talking about him & smiling, he doesn't mind that he killed Ace at all
You consider this a Villain?

 

[Nessos]

You're saying Akainu would kill Dressrosa Citizens to hide the defeat of Doflamingo, that's crazy!!

Thats not what I said, I said Sakazuki would kill the Dressrosa citizen to kill Luffy.

 

[Salah Eddine]

Thats not what I said, I said Sakazuki would kill the Dressrosa citizen to kill Luffy.

They were in different situations, Dressrosa Citizens didn't directly confront Fujitora and tried to save Luffy
They simply ran in his direction so that Fujitora can't drop the Rubble on them, it was a smart move where they help Luffy without acting as Criminals

That's why i was shocked when you said Akainu would kill the Citizens
We don't know what Fujitora would have done if some citizens attacked him while he was fighting Luffy

Also if we truly compare, you think Akainu would help Doffy, let himself be insulted and ignore his crimes??
Akainu would have ignored his Shichibukai Title and stopped him right there & then
So Fujitora's Justice was also lacking and caused problems, that's why i said there is no Villain among Marines, just different Justice & Philosophies, the corrupt ones are those who work with Pirates (Nezumi for example)

 

[Waindo]

I just glanced trough all 6 chapters this is fckin amazing, I hope Oda is keeping tabs on this.

 

[Nessos]

They were in different situations, Dressrosa Citizens didn't directly confront Fujitora and tried to save Luffy
They simply ran in his direction so that Fujitora can't drop the Rubble on them, it was a smart move where they help Luffy without acting as Criminals

That's why i was shocked when you said Akainu would kill the Citizens
We don't know what Fujitora would have done if some citizens attacked him while he was fighting Luffy

Also if we truly compare, you think Akainu would help Doffy, let himself be insulted and ignore his crimes??
Akainu would have ignored his Shichibukai Title and stopped him right there & then
So Fujitora's Justice was also lacking and caused problems, that's why i said there is no Villain among Marines, just different Justice & Philosophies, the corrupt ones are those who work with Pirates (Nezumi for example)

I completly agree with you saying "Sakazuki wouldn't have ignore Doflamingos crimes followed by directly taking him down".

But my point is again, he would have killed any citizen of Dressrosa standing in his way to kill Luffy. Even so the citizen didn't dona crime. And thats shown in by Sakazukis behaviour in Ohara.

(@Emperor Cross red marked part is why I see Sakazuki as potential One Piece version of Hitler, He Said similiar stuff during MF war regarding the blood of Dragon and Roger. Based on statements like these we can expect Sakazuki would repeat stuff killing all bloodrelatives of criminals, even unborn kids.)

And I would also say it wasn't orders from above. In the refugee shils were also Marines and Sakazuki was the only one shooting at them.