[FIN] Traditional Mafia The Gang Plays Mafia [Mafia Championship Practice]

[Waindo]

We aren't allowed to discuss flavour here btw @Waindo .

Whoopsie daisy well I haven't discussed it with anyone but myself. I mean I barely mentioned it. Does that count?

 

[Dragomir]

Rej
Stray Cat
Shottie
Ted
Okosan/Nessos
Gambit
Oreki
Trafalgar Law
Samael
Waindo
Beky
Michelle

Oreki
I will have to admit that this guy my read has continuously flip flopped in my head. I originally had a problem with his first 10 or so posts, specifically #210. In that post he had made a response to my question asking about how he felt about something. The first thing he says is that my question doesn’t give anything to the discussion. This is obviously accusatory and implies some level of FoS as not bringing stuff to the table is always considered to be a bad look. But, in his next post he immediately dismisses it as nothing and just me questioning. This has me wondering just why the hell would you talk it about it in the first place if it didn’t mean anything? He was clearly soft pushing my post, having been bad by saying it didn’t bring anything to the discussion but the immediate dismiss of it pinged me. There’s no clear progression in those 2 thoughts and that had me initially thinking of a wolf first thinking about pushing as bad and using it against me but dropping it after not liking that idea. I’ve done that plenty of times before and I find it to be a reasonable thing to conclude.


Next, I never liked his Nessos read. The reasons he had were weak and lacked any sort of thorough explanation. You could have dumbed it down to “Nessos is bad because he pressured Michelle.” How is that exactly a bad thing that would showcase Nessos being scum? We don’t know, he failed to explain it. He did mention a lack of substance and it is precisely because of that lack why I thought his read was fake. He didn’t appear to be truly trying to solve Nessos and showcase why he’s such a big bad wolf worthy of a vote. No real case got me thinking its not a genuine read and I still think that. Furthermore, he never had a single interaction with Nessos, not a single time was he trying to prod or question Nessos about his thought process or his pressuring of Michelle. That’s what I meant by not trying to solve Nessos. That Nessos scum read was simply whack.


However, with all this, there were some things that I’ve come to like about Oreki. First of all, his scum read on Juliet. Although I don’t agree with the reasoning, the suspicion felt real. He was strong with it and didn’t beat around the bush and he seemed genuinely interested in getting others to share their thoughts about her. I would do the same. When you got a strong scum read, you want to know how others feel about them to see if they share the same thoughts. You obviously want to start a wagon and get them lynched, which is what he did. I connect with it.


This day phase, I have started to like Oreki more and more. He’s not fucking around when it comes to his scum reads. He’s putting them out wholeheartedly and dropping them votes too. Even though he has lacked explanation, he’s not coming off as forced but more like a “yep, let’s fucking role baby” and I like it. It’s the type of mentality I like to have too. He has been very engaged with the thread and has continuously called out Law, Waindo, and me. Man’s been looking great. I’m actually very close to town reading him for this DP alone.


Michelle
My first read on her was town. She was relaxed and chilling during the first half of the D1. Her posts didn’t have a forced tone behind it that would indicate that she was just trying to appear contributive. She simply did her own thing and at her own pace.


This initial has quickly gone away after seeing her interaction with Gambit. Likewise to Oreki, she failed to do any explanation as to why he was actually scum. You can go check it out for yourself. Her reasons were never explained and in the post in which she voted for Gambit only contained questions for the man. The questions in general were fine but none of them showed any progression about why Gambit was scum. The case was quite literally non-existent and this bothers me tremendously. It’s worse than Oreki’s one on Nessos.


Now, it’s after her case on Gambit that has me super bothered. She hadn’t done crap afterwards. She pretty much coasted for the rest of the phase(I did too but I have reasons why, Mich’s, Idk). She made no pushes against Gambit after voting him. Absolutely none. She wasn’t trying to find scum, she really didn’t appear like that to me. She was on cruise mode and not furthering any game progress. I especially dislike the lack of desire to get Gambit lynched. Not even trying to get any else to share the same suspicion. She was a static and stagnant player(not in the way that Beky said for Nessos).

I decided to only give out my thoughts on those two players for now as they have been the only ones I've come after this phase. If you guys wish for an explanation on any other player then ask and I will give it to you. Right now, I'll focus on these past few pages and onward.

 

[Stray Cat]

Tbh I'm not really feeling it this DP. Feels like there is something missing and so many not contributing clearly doesn't help in any way.

Oreki would be the obvious choice for this DP's lynch, but given that his arguments actually make sense and have logic I don't get scum vibes from him anymore.

Dragomir contradicts himself, but his response to the accusations don't come off as faked, so this might just be frustration.

Law seems scummy for putting me in his scum list, yet not pushing for more reads from my side.

Shottie seems good, but I cannot ignore how joby tried to convince people of me being scum. And yes, she did.

Gambit is taking quiet a backseat ever since he threw his tantrum. He has every right to ignore what I say if he is Town, but he should at least interact with other players. You can only play the annoyed Townie card for so long. And right now it seems like he plays it on purpose.

Rej taking a backseat is also quite weird tbh.

Beky was here and at least had a good argument. Don't feel any scum vibes from him yet.

Michelle made a logical case on Gambit. And I don't feel any scum vibes from her yet.

Okosan wasn't even here yet, so I have to wait for him to catch up and contribute. Although Nessos seemed good later on.

Samael is busy and trying to contribute. Liking him so far. His play seems different from his scum play. So unless he changed his scum game he is fine so far.


Waindo is just straight up weird. But how deep he thought about my change in scum play just gives off Town vibes.

Ted: While he seemingly gradually evaluated his opinion on me, that's how it seems, at least, he has yet to answer me regarding the Gambit Michelle exchange.


So those are my reads.

 

[Samael]

This read looks weak. So weak that it feels forced to be made but aside from that, where's the actual scum read? By this I mean where's the stuff that make Waindo scum and why? In here you seemed a lot more concerned on pinpointing why somethings didn't make him town but you failed to make the follow up as to why these things are wolf indicative.

This read lacks explanation, thus appearing weak. It comes off as forced because it just looks like you're trying to find a target to ours not really deduce the scum.

I have a specific question about the bold. Tell me Mich, is it an inherently scummy thing to come up with a scum team while not being fully caught up? You don't make reads on the spot?

I get a lot of wrong vibes from this post. Discrediting attempts again. While it lacks explanation to you, the reasoning was clear as to why they felt how they did on that poster.

you seem to just latched onto the first post you could come across and make yourself look good/productive and the other bad.
After someone exposed your play, (stray) which now that I think about it puts them in a better light, you changed. You’re not jumping into everything aggressively, nor are you making the claims you did before. Instead you seem more like the town dragomir, the one that was pointed out. This comes off as a lost meant to be seen as calculated and meaningful, productive but instead it’s emotionless, has no substance. It’s fake.

i like the effort by Michelle and I can see the logic that you’re trying to tear down

Vote Dragomir

Until
Further notice this is where I’m placing my chips at and im
Catching up. Depending on what I see this can change or just make me more confident. A nice lynch candidate alongside waindo. Possibly better due to the connections you can give us.

He hasn't shown anything that could have made me reevaluate this read tbh. He's a strong scum hunter, but I don't see him scum hunting. There was no logic in his play.

His defensiveness towards me aside which could seem logical for a Townie there is no logic in his interactions with other players. His reaction towards a simple question from Michelle was not justified by anything. Just like him not defending himself when he was about to be lynched.

Outside of Gambit what do you have? Stray your so confusing this game. One moment it’s wow and the next it’s damn maybe I’m wrong? Continuously pushing on him isn’t doing much, others just aren’t seeing it how you are and I feel it’s making you look bad.
Especially since there’s been no progression.

Oreki

I see oreki as a low hanging fruit, just a poster in the background. He’s neutral because I don’t see him doing much of anything honestly. Where’d scum come from and for those town reading him how’d you come upon that read?

michelle town reading. I didn’t like her early on because of the wrong reasons, people were backing her instead of her doing it herself. But these last few pages I’ve seen pressure, solid defenses and etc.. Michelle is legit right now imo.
Gambit he’s starting to come off as a useless townie right now. I don’t think him voting stray was a scum
Move but just a townie with no intentions to do anything.
stray my strongest town read, I’ve noticed the calm demeanor never left and I love it, while stray has faults she makes up for them with good pushes or turning her defensive post into offensive with her questions. No back tracking, firm views, I like stray.
Dragomir i don’t know about him. Drago seems fake honestly, he’s riding off a hot start and putting himself in others business, jumping in with opinions Drago has no firm stances that I can think of. The post of shottie giving instances on you flip flopping with inconsistencies is crazy
shottie new but town as fuck! Love the pushes, the genuineness of the post and everything about shottie right now honestly. There points on Drago are legit and I agree with them
Just a bit. Want a bit more outside of just waindo and Drago but maybe he just doesn’t seem anything.
Ted I love him now, he’s taken charge and has the most effort imo that’s truly for the best rather than trying to gain cred he’s just pushing thoughts out. Legit.
Beky is scum. I don’t like her at all. Beky isn’t into anything, has no pushes and is only standing in the fray and defending herself. Would like to see more but as of right now scum. Definitely scum. That defense of Michelle is still fresh and the nitpicking sht that happened early on.

I’m not looking into any Michelle and gambit bs. It’s stale and clear nothing is coming from it.

I don't know franklin and I am not him lol


I am not pretty sure but if i have to my hunches goes with

Scum lean

Dragomir
Shottie

Unsure

Rej
Samael
Beky
Traffy
Wai
Gambit

the rest is a town for me

I was green in your previous list. What changed.

 

[tedxtr]

Did Waindo reply to any of my cases yet?

 

[Samael]

All in
All
I’m fucking confused and scared man. This happened before where it was just town literally beefing and game play/ play styles clashing and mafia simply directing and piggy backing.

 

[tedxtr]

Guys you’re literally letting Waindo slip through the cracks for nothing.

He TMI’d Stray town and made a bogus push on me and he avoided any of my posts.

 

[Stray Cat]

@Dragomir here you have Michelle explaining her thought process. How can you say this is nothing?

@Dragomir

breaking the quote to explain:


1. We are playing mafia This is a game but each day we pretend we lynch a person. This is making the game deadly serious. When an interaction is too friendly something is off when there is nothing else than pleasantries. If soemone points this out in any way you shouldn't be bothred by him showing your own fluff behaviour while you admit it. It's like deflecting attention from it which scum often are doing.


2. I think this is clear, I said that he exaggerated when he said what I assumed.
Town has a more prudent approach or a more direct one. Gambit was just twisting my words to shade me.


3. Gambit didn't answer at this iirc, and also i don't think him ignoring my willingness to understand correct his posts shows a towny mindset from him.


4. He doesn't ask what my intention is, he directly comes with the idea I was trying to solicit a wagon on him. I never called anyone to join me. I only asked for reads from other players.
Scum want to show a townie has 'scum behaviour' even if this is a fake thought.


5. Here Gambit was redirecting the convo in other direction, to Cat for whom I had and still have a TR, and I noticed that often scum have the tendency to link themselves to a townie. So if my read on Cat is right, Gambit has to be scum from this imo.
Also he says I am insinuating things, but in fact he is the one doing this.


6. Saying my play is an act is another shade btw... I thought that his conclusions comes not from what I said but from his need to push his narrative.
the lmao thing is a scummy fake joyful mood, put there to show fake relaxation but doesn't really match with the meaning of the post, so I take it as a scum claim tbh.
You never found scum by spotting fake wanna be aggreable tone?


I think this is clear and shows in tl;dr my reasons to vote.


the above shows you my thought process.

I still think Gambit is scum, but i have the idea of what if I am biased in any way and Ona was right for reading him town at Eod.
Idk what to do and I need more content from Gambit. After all Ona is human and he can make a mistake and I need to understand the truth here.

 

[tedxtr]

Lynch Waindo glgl

 

[Waindo]

Did Waindo reply to any of my cases yet?

I probably didn't. Jog my memory a bit on that.

 

[tedxtr]

I probably didn't. Jog my memory a bit on that.

Go back and read them

You were literally in thread as I was typing it all and just ignored it

 

[Oreki]

I was green in your previous list. What changed.

My town lean on you was based on my feeling, you just come across me as a town with your posts, questions and the way you were expressing them... but as the DP moved and with all these new questions I am becoming conflicted towards my reads.

 

[Waindo]

Go back and read them

You were literally in thread as I was typing it all and just ignored it

I probably replied in my own manner.

 

[Oreki]

@tedxtr who do you think are the remaining scum? Or at least who lean towards?

 

[Waindo]

@tedxtr who do you think are the remaining scum? Or at least who lean towards?

He'll say Waindo.

 

[Stray Cat]

@Samael read my post above. We kinda Ninja'd each other xD.

 

[Dragomir]

@Dragomir here you have Michelle explaining her thought process. How can you say this is nothing?

I didn't see that post. The post I was talking about wasn't that one.

 

[Waindo]

I get a lot of wrong vibes from this post. Discrediting attempts again. While it lacks explanation to you, the reasoning was clear as to why they felt how they did on that poster.

you seem to just latched onto the first post you could come across and make yourself look good/productive and the other bad.
After someone exposed your play, (stray) which now that I think about it puts them in a better light, you changed. You’re not jumping into everything aggressively, nor are you making the claims you did before. Instead you seem more like the town dragomir, the one that was pointed out. This comes off as a lost meant to be seen as calculated and meaningful, productive but instead it’s emotionless, has no substance. It’s fake.

i like the effort by Michelle and I can see the logic that you’re trying to tear down

Vote Dragomir

Until
Further notice this is where I’m placing my chips at and im
Catching up. Depending on what I see this can change or just make me more confident. A nice lynch candidate alongside waindo. Possibly better due to the connections you can give us.


Outside of Gambit what do you have? Stray your so confusing this game. One moment it’s wow and the next it’s damn maybe I’m wrong? Continuously pushing on him isn’t doing much, others just aren’t seeing it how you are and I feel it’s making you look bad.
Especially since there’s been no progression.


I see oreki as a low hanging fruit, just a poster in the background. He’s neutral because I don’t see him doing much of anything honestly. Where’d scum come from and for those town reading him how’d you come upon that read?

michelle town reading. I didn’t like her early on because of the wrong reasons, people were backing her instead of her doing it herself. But these last few pages I’ve seen pressure, solid defenses and etc.. Michelle is legit right now imo.
Gambit he’s starting to come off as a useless townie right now. I don’t think him voting stray was a scum
Move but just a townie with no intentions to do anything.
stray my strongest town read, I’ve noticed the calm demeanor never left and I love it, while stray has faults she makes up for them with good pushes or turning her defensive post into offensive with her questions. No back tracking, firm views, I like stray.
Dragomir i don’t know about him. Drago seems fake honestly, he’s riding off a hot start and putting himself in others business, jumping in with opinions Drago has no firm stances that I can think of. The post of shottie giving instances on you flip flopping with inconsistencies is crazy
shottie new but town as fuck! Love the pushes, the genuineness of the post and everything about shottie right now honestly. There points on Drago are legit and I agree with them
Just a bit. Want a bit more outside of just waindo and Drago but maybe he just doesn’t seem anything.
Ted I love him now, he’s taken charge and has the most effort imo that’s truly for the best rather than trying to gain cred he’s just pushing thoughts out. Legit.
Beky is scum. I don’t like her at all. Beky isn’t into anything, has no pushes and is only standing in the fray and defending herself. Would like to see more but as of right now scum. Definitely scum. That defense of Michelle is still fresh and the nitpicking sht that happened early on.

I’m not looking into any Michelle and gambit bs. It’s stale and clear nothing is coming from it.


I was green in your previous list. What changed.

He is now a scum lean so his list was tweaked to suit the situation.

 

[Dragomir]

Gambit's wall... ...you like to pile up words. Putting some numbers for reference:
1.
That was cute? Then you claim it NAI? Why is this bothering you then?
2.
when I said is lock? Don't put words in my mouth and don't twist my words please!
3.
No. I wanted a confirmation because i am less than ESL and sometimes I need the confirmation i get right the sentence.
I didn't find any help at this tbh.
What "capitalize" means in your sentence?
4.

i wanted a read
5.

Aren't you assuming too much here? What are Stray doing in this when it was never about her in all the convo?
I think this accusation is a shade who doesn't make sense from my pov and i wish to know why are you doing it. Nvm actually..
6.

When i ever wanted such thing? You are overdefensive in your wall and in the same time you are accusing me several times instead searching for the reason I asked my questions.
Your "lmao" is forced and makes me think you want to hide behind it like all you posted is not really serious and this is insulting for me tbh. :/

I'll tell you my conclusion here: the only way I can find a sense for all your behaviour is if you are scum.
Misinterpreting my posts, being too wordy and defensive, accusing me for imaginary things i didn't do, all this is scummy.

Vote lynch: Gambit

This is the post that I was talking about @Stray Cat

 

[Stray Cat]

I didn't see that post. The post I was talking about wasn't that one.

How can you scum read a player that has such an elaborate post, though? You can literally grasp her line of thoughts there. I don't like your discrediting attempt on her tbh.
[automerge]1587320654[/automerge]

This is the post that I was talking about @Stray Cat

No, the post I quoted when asking you this.