That's actually quite interesting..- Shinobu's fear of sharp objects and her dramatic....aging actually point to her being either tortured and/or transformed in some way. Whatever the case, it may be somehow tied to Witching Hour Boy, whose character Oda may've not only obviously based on legendary thief Nezumi Kozo ( aka Rat Kid ) from Japanese lore, but possibly also an equally infamous curse associated with the Witching Hour itself ( hence the name change in the adaptation of said legend to the One Piece landscape ) - the Ushi no Toki Mairi
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ushi_no_toki_mairi
Any big anime/manger junkie is probably already familiar with the basic gist of it; a voodoo-like curse involving a straw doll, nails, and a malicious practitioner wearing a ring of candles around the head. In this case, easy to see how Shinobu could've turned out to be the victim of such a curse.
Now, is that to say Witching Hour Boy is a villain? Was Shinobu captured and forced to squeal by Orochi's forces? I won't even begin to claim I have a fucking clue about who did what. I'm only saying it's likely there's some connection there between Shinobu and Witching Hour Boy that probably involves the elements of jealousy and voodoo dolls lol. Could be something as absurd as WHBoy actually being a girl who's envious of Raizo's hypothetical infatuation w/ Shinobu from days back or something, having "cursed" Shinobu by turning her into some kinda living voodoo doll with some devil fruit ability or something haha. Who knows.
Is this because Kaido wanted him to join his crew even though he sentenced him to death 20 years ago with Oden and rest of the Scabbards?Wow, looks like I made a good thread here.
To me now, I'm hellbent on the traitor being Shutenmaru/Ashura Douji.. something I've had an idea for about 4 or 5 months straight now... If it is a scabbard, I really think it's him, in my opinion.
If anyone is wondering why I've picked him all this time, I'll be making a theory sometime this week to share my thoughts about this... It has to be this week, since the traitor thing is soon gonna pop up anytime now.
That's actually quite interesting..
And not to mention, didn't Robin discover voodoo dolls or something like that in a certain room?
And yeah.. I'm not sure if the witching hour boy might turn out to be a villain (though anything's possible at this stage xD), but could it be that every time the witching hour boy made his move, it was at the exact time Oden died?? And maybe the witching hour boy acted as such, in order to keep reminding the people of Oden's death, and ensure he won't be forgotten?? I mean, he wasn't present when Oden was alive, that's for sure.
But that's pretty much my take on it.
Kokeshi dolls IIRC, as in the ones Hitetsu enjoys collecting. Leads me to believe he was also a guard or some such at the palace, in charge of the poneglyph, official bladesmith ,and such.And not to mention, didn't Robin discover voodoo dolls or something like that in a certain room?
Yeah, probably just an eccentric character with a bone to pick with somebody, but otherwise harmless. I'm probably going to side with those who've postulated it's Toko for now.And yeah.. I'm not sure if the witching hour boy might turn out to be a villain (though anything's possible at this stage xD),
Witching Hour Boy tends to strike at night tho, at the Hours of the Ox ( 1 - 3 am or something like that ). Or maybe that's just when he makes his drops?but could it be that every time the witching hour boy made his move, it was at the exact time Oden died?? And maybe the witching hour boy acted as such, in order to keep reminding the people of Oden's death, and ensure he won't be forgotten?? I mean, he wasn't present when Oden was alive, that's for sure.
But that's pretty much my take on it.
Actually, it goes much, much further than that!Is this because Kaido wanted him to join his crew even though he sentenced him to death 20 years ago with Oden and rest of the Scabbards?
This is really interesting and i need to think about this more. But why did Shutenmaru attack Jack?Actually, it goes much, much further than that!
I'll just try to summarize a bit here, since things will get pretty long:
Shutenmaru - for 20 years - has waited patiently until the day Kinemon would arrive, but these 20 years had a drastic effect on him. He lost his comrades and his childhood friends to Kaido and Orochi 10 or so years ago, and ultimately lost his will to fight.. he saw the impossibility of Kaido being taken down, and witnessed how Kaido alone was the reason why all the past rebellions failed... even waiting for Kinemon took its toll on him.
His anger directed at Kinemon at why it took so long for him to return was not only because of the death and loss of his comrades at the hands of Kaido 10 years ago, but also because he gave up his will to fight.... which is what transformed him from a former retainer to Oden, back into what he once was: a bandit leader, who robbed villages and innocent people of their belongings.
Even in his introduction, he had no longer any faith that Toki's prophecy would ever come true... he no longer even considered himself as a "man whom samurai could follow" and depend on (likely due to what happened 10 years ago), or even a samurai who could protect others.. he even witnessed how Luffy got one-shotted by Kaido - Luffy, the guy Kinemon talks highly of - emphasising the realization of how hopeless it is to take down Kaido...
He even said "Wano's days are numbered" (JBOX trans).. it's as if he's accepted Wano's fate already, and gave up, choosing to do nothing to revert such change... in other words, he's lost hope of Kaido ever being taken down...
Like all the other past uprisings, he probably thinks this one will also be doomed to fail... and so his main motive - if he is the traitor - is that he doesn't want any more lives being countlessly wasted away, like what happened in the past... which is quite like Oden, and why he became what he was throughout these 5 years in Wano.... Oden chose to bear the burden and protect Wano by himself, because he doesn't want people to die... Shutenmaru is in a similar path; he wants to prevent these 4,200 people from destroying their lives in what he sees as a plan doomed to fail, like every other plan that has been instigated against Kaido and Orochi.
He also stated clearly in a specific chapter, that he doesn't care for the other scabbards - not even Momonosuke... but he cares for Oden and loves him just as much as the other scabbards did... yet, he probably thinks it's way too late now (20 years!) for the scabbards to come into play again and make any difference... and thinks the scabbards have lived way past their due....... I also believe Shutenmaru's intending to die with all the other scabbards in Onigashima .... as they have lived far enough, but that's just speculation on my part.
I mean, put it another way... all of them loved Oden, but with Kinemon, Kanjuro, Kiku, and Raizou, their witnessing of Oden's execution is still fresh in their minds (3 months ago!)... Kawamatsu was caught and left to rot in jail, but he was there, waiting for that day to come... but with Shutenmaru, he experienced a lot of shit these past 20 years, even having his childhood comrades slain 10 years ago, whilst waiting and waiting for Kinemon to come, unable to do anything but wait... with all that, it's surely enough for someone to lose their will to fight... especially when every other rebellion in the past has failed.. He probably joined the alliance in order to ruin the plan and prevent countless lives from being wasted away, with such a plan that he thinks will definitely fail..
With Shutenmaru right now, he probably just wants himself and the other scabbards to die fighting for their master, Oden - who is long dead - whilst ensuring no-one else gets killed... just like how Oden destroyed his life... doing so, whilst ensuring no-one else gets killed, and protecting Wano's people with his dying breath.
And assuming I'm right with the whole idea of Shutenmaru and his motives... if he is the traitor, he will also come to realize that what he's done was wrong all this time - in the aftermath of Onigashima - and he will certainly take full part with the fight against Kaido and Orochi, and redeem himself in any way... he might even save Hiyori and Momo from death, by killing Orochi in the end, probably, as a way for Oda to redeem him.
There is also the case of Shutenmaru's character being very very similar to a known figure in japanese history - the bandit leader who killed Akechi Mitsuhide - the latter, whom Orochi closely resembles in Wano.... which is also why I think Shutenmaru is certainly playing a bigger role in Wano than what we might expect!!
I know there are some counter-points to this, but I'll also address them as much as I can, in this theory. But I know I could very well be wrong as everyone else, so I also take my prediction with a grain of salt.
But one thing's certain... even with the latest chapter...
The traitor is indeed, among the scabbards. There's no denying it.
EDIT: Woah.. for a summary, this is long as hell.
I'm so sorry about this..
I can dig this.Actually, it goes much, much further than that!
I'll just try to summarize a bit here, since things will get pretty long:
Shutenmaru - for 20 years - has waited patiently until the day Kinemon would arrive, but these 20 years had a drastic effect on him. He lost his comrades and his childhood friends to Kaido and Orochi 10 or so years ago, and ultimately lost his will to fight.. he saw the impossibility of Kaido being taken down, and witnessed how Kaido alone was the reason why all the past rebellions failed... even waiting for Kinemon took its toll on him.
His anger directed at Kinemon at why it took so long for him to return was not only because of the death and loss of his comrades at the hands of Kaido 10 years ago, but also because he gave up his will to fight.... which is what transformed him from a former retainer to Oden, back into what he once was: a bandit leader, who robbed villages and innocent people of their belongings.
Even in his introduction, he had no longer any faith that Toki's prophecy would ever come true... he no longer even considered himself as a "man whom samurai could follow" and depend on (likely due to what happened 10 years ago), or even a samurai who could protect others.. he even witnessed how Luffy got one-shotted by Kaido - Luffy, the guy Kinemon talks highly of - emphasising the realization of how hopeless it is to take down Kaido...
He even said "Wano's days are numbered" (JBOX trans).. it's as if he's accepted Wano's fate already, and gave up, choosing to do nothing to revert such change... in other words, he's lost hope of Kaido ever being taken down...
Like all the other past uprisings, he probably thinks this one will also be doomed to fail... and so his main motive - if he is the traitor - is that he doesn't want any more lives being countlessly wasted away, like what happened in the past... which is quite like Oden, and why he became what he was throughout these 5 years in Wano.... Oden chose to bear the burden and protect Wano by himself, because he doesn't want people to die... Shutenmaru is in a similar path; he wants to prevent these 4,200 people from destroying their lives in what he sees as a plan doomed to fail, like every other plan that has been instigated against Kaido and Orochi.
He also stated clearly in a specific chapter, that he doesn't care for the other scabbards - not even Momonosuke... but he cares for Oden and loves him just as much as the other scabbards did... yet, he probably thinks it's way too late now (20 years!) for the scabbards to come into play again and make any difference... and thinks the scabbards have lived way past their due....... I also believe Shutenmaru's intending to die with all the other scabbards in Onigashima .... as they have lived far enough, but that's just speculation on my part.
I mean, put it another way... all of them loved Oden, but with Kinemon, Kanjuro, Kiku, and Raizou, their witnessing of Oden's execution is still fresh in their minds (3 months ago!)... Kawamatsu was caught and left to rot in jail, but he was there, waiting for that day to come... but with Shutenmaru, he experienced a lot of shit these past 20 years, even having his childhood comrades slain 10 years ago, whilst waiting and waiting for Kinemon to come, unable to do anything but wait... with all that, it's surely enough for someone to lose their will to fight... especially when every other rebellion in the past has failed.. He probably joined the alliance in order to ruin the plan and prevent countless lives from being wasted away, with such a plan that he thinks will definitely fail..
With Shutenmaru right now, he probably just wants himself and the other scabbards to die fighting for their master, Oden - who is long dead - whilst ensuring no-one else gets killed... just like how Oden destroyed his life... doing so, whilst ensuring no-one else gets killed, and protecting Wano's people with his dying breath.
And assuming I'm right with the whole idea of Shutenmaru and his motives... if he is the traitor, he will also come to realize that what he's done was wrong all this time - in the aftermath of Onigashima - and he will certainly take full part with the fight against Kaido and Orochi, and redeem himself in any way... he might even save Hiyori and Momo from death, by killing Orochi in the end, probably, as a way for Oda to redeem him.
There is also the case of Shutenmaru's character being very very similar to a known figure in japanese history - the bandit leader who killed Akechi Mitsuhide - the latter, whom Orochi closely resembles in Wano.... which is also why I think Shutenmaru is certainly playing a bigger role in Wano than what we might expect!!
I know there are some counter-points to this, but I'll also address them as much as I can, in this theory. But I know I could very well be wrong as everyone else, so I also take my prediction with a grain of salt.
But one thing's certain... even with the latest chapter...
The traitor is indeed, among the scabbards. There's no denying it.
EDIT: Woah.. for a summary, this is long as hell.
I'm so sorry about this..
I could say it's because even though Shutenmaru lost his will to fight all these years, his love for Oden is still there, and him attacking Jack and refusing Kaido's offer of serving under him is because of Kaido killing his comrades in the past, as well as Oden... but even with him giving up, he sees Kaido's peons as enemies, but as long as Kaido is in Wano, it is hopeless for him to do anything, as was shown 10 years ago, which is why he gave up..This is really interesting and i need to think about this more. But why did Shutenmaru attack Jack?
this is basically my rational for kinn being the traitor, accept I think that he lost his faith in oden after oden ran away to become a pirate and kaido and orochi first arrived on the scene. This would have been when Kaido and Orochi figured out how to get Kinnemon under their thumb.Also, I guess Kaido wanted him as a subordinate in the past, and Shutenmaru refused.. it's not that he treats Kaido and Orochi as allies... he definitely wants them taken down (or "wanted", since he lost his will to fight all these years), but with the past rebellions proving how impossible it was to take down Kaido, with loss of life, it gives the idea that Shutenmaru sees Kinemon's plan failing like every other plan, and ending up a total disaster.
Kanjuro seems to do everything wrong on purpose as to hinder any operation and was only ever serious when it came to the traitor. Basically changing the energy to it not being important. If you call this a red herring with this information alone I might agree with you but by process of elimination it can only be him or Raizo. Yes, it is not possible that a random mink has all the information that was given to the enemy, it can only be some one who was present 20 years ago and now being in the most inner circle of the alliance. Kaido confirming that there is a traitor already back then almost cuts out every other possibility as well. Though, I would grant that it could be a complete red herring and the reveal is that there was no traitor because Orochi has some kind of ability user. Him/Her being the 4th calamity would be interesting because it was set up in the slightest and we wait for him/Her appearance. A scorpion lives mostly underground and maybe there is a whole network below Wano that we haven't realized yet is there. That would be a bit random but still a great revelation.My prediction:
Kanjuro will be a important character, he is inconspicious and his devil fruit will be helpful to reach places that can't be reached specifically.
He has good ninja qualities like Shinobu or Raizo as he could literally draw birds to carry him while flight.
Kanjuro is awesome and he is collected, he is the perfect sidekick to Kine'mon.
Stop trusting in red herrings. We are looking for a traitor related to the fourth calamity, it is possible that we look for a mink here, unrelated to Inuarashi and Nekomamushi.
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I've had that idea in my mind for quite a while, actually.. xDI foresee Hiyori and Kyoshiro plotting to overthrow Orochi,
There is also another reason why I really think Shutenmaru will be the one to kill Orochi.Could even see Ashura siding with them in this scenario if turns out to be a bloodless coup ( on the Kozuki side anyways ).